PVO NewsDay

09 Nov 2015 Transcipt

E&OE TRANSCRIPT
Interview – PVO NewsDay
Monday 9 November 2015


SUBJECTS:
The GST, VET reforms, anti-terror laws, Christmas Island Unrest, Constituent Quesiton Time, Trade Union Royal Commission, The Whitlam Dismissal

PETER VAN ONSELEN: Thanks very much for being there.

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Good afternoon Peter.

PETER VAN ONSELEN: Let’s get to the GST first up. There’s a lot to talk about from this week. The GST won’t be on the legislative agenda but it’s clearly on the agenda when it comes to discussion about a tax reform package. We spoke to Scott Morrison on Australian Agenda just yesterday. The government is obviously open minded about this, how long do you think it’ll take before you’ll formulate what you’ll take to the next election in terms of tax reform, which might include adjustments to the GST.

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Well, Peter next election’s not due for another 12 months, so we’ve still got a third of the term to go and what we’re doing as government is engaging the Australian public in a proper and reasonable, considered debate about what kind of tax system we need to have that creates the revenue that the tax payers expect us to raise and then spend on essential services like defence or education or health and this is an important test of Australia because we need to be able to have reasonable debates without the hyperbole that comes from the Labor Party shutting down those debates that’s killing the body politic in Australia. If we can raise issues and discuss them sensibly then we are in dire straits as a nation and that’s the alternative under Labor, not actually addressing any serious issues.

PETER VAN ONSELEN: But in fairness Christopher Pyne, you tweeted on the 8th of January ‘there will be no change to the rate or base of the GST, none. Just because someone floats an idea doesn’t make it party policy.’ That’s shutting down the debate the same way Labor are now doing.

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: No, it remains exactly the same situation we have now. There are no plans to change the rate of the GST, none at all. We are just having a discussion about the tax system from all sorts of different angles. Some state premiers want to raise the GST in order to get more revenue for health and education, others want to increase the Medicare levy, others want to do none of those things. This is the kind of debate we should be able to have in Australia in a mature way. Now, Labor has shown themselves as being incapable of having that debate. We are capable of having it and I think the Australian public are mature and sophisticated enough to be able to have that debate as well. But there are no policies to change the GST.

PETER VAN ONSELEN: But you didn’t say there are no policies, Christopher Pyne, you said there will be no change. Now, I hope you’re wrong because I’d like to see a change to the GST but this is the problem, politicians, you corner yourselves with rhetoric. Tony Abbot did it on that SBS interview, Julia Gillard did it on Channel 10 - be careful what you tweet.

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: No, I think you’re making a storm out of a teacup

PETER VAN ONSELEN: Alright, well let’s move on anyway. I hope I’m making a storm in a teacup because I want to see reform to the GST but what is going to happen this week. There’s a fair bit on the legislative agenda…

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Well Peter you’re engaging in exactly the kind of behaviour that you criticising at the same time, you’re trying to have a ‘gotcha’ moment with me, which is exactly the reason why we can’t have mature debate in Australia, at the same time as you’re saying you want to have mature debate, and yet you’ve gone back and found some tweet of mine from January the 8th which doesn’t actually contradict anything else that I’ve said and are pretending that it does, so you’re, in fact doing, exactly the same thing that you’re criticising us for doing.

PETER VAN ONSELEN: In fairness, I mean I don’t want to get caught up in the pedantics of this, if fairness, firstly I didn’t find it someone tweeted it to me. I wasn’t trawling through your twitter feed, don’t worry Mr Pyne.

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: We’ll you’re raising it.

PETER VAN ONSELEN: That’s true, but in fairness, the reason I’m raising it is because….

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: You don’t have to raise everything that’s sent to you do you?

PETER VAN ONSELEN: Well, no, I don’t raise everything that’s sent to me but in fairness you didn’t say in that tweet there are no plans, you said there will be no change. I just think that that was perhaps unnecessarily cautious but let’s move on. I want to ask you about the week ahead. There’s some vocational education training changes that you’re looking to put through and also I read in the papers some changes around these citizenship laws. Is your expectation that you’ll be able to get those through both Houses this week or are we only talking about the lower house?

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: No, my expectation we’ll get them both through the House of Representatives this week so we are dealing with reforms around vocational education and training. The VET free help scheme that was set up as an open ended scheme by Kim Carr while he was Minister for vocation education and training and Simon Birmingham and Luke Hartsuyker and now fixing that problem that he created, which is a very important change. And secondly of course, the long awaited debate around the Australian citizenship law changes to strip duel citizens of their Australian citizenship when they are fighting with a terrorist organisation overseas, will be the second half of this week, so, two very significant changes. They’ll go through the House of Representatives this week and I would then expect them to be debated in the Senate in the very near future.

PETER VAN ONSELEN: And, on the kerfuffle going on at Christmas Island, the head of border force has made it clear that it’s not a riot but there is, obviously, some tension there. Do you understand, I suppose what can be a frustration for some people that, yes, from the government perspective there might be some misreporting about something that’s not a riot being described as a riot but by the same token it’s difficult all around when there are limited access point. Is there a way through on this?

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Well, I think Peter Dutton is handling this matter extremely effectively. Obviously there is tension on Christmas Island as there would be in many places, in many detention centres with people who wish to come to Australia through unauthorised means or are being detained because they’ve been found to have overstayed their visas, for example. That does lead to tension and we have had an incident over the weekend which has been extremely tragic and unfortunate for those concerned. But I think Peter Dutton is managing the issue very well. There has obviously been damage done to the Christmas Island detention facility but, at this stage, the absolute details are sketchy from my point of view because I’m not the minister but I’m sure Peter Dutton will have more to say about that over the coming hours.

PETER VAN ONSELEN: And today, Mr Pyne, is the first constituent question time. It’s a bit of a gimmick isn’t because you can already do that? Backbenchers can already ask questions specific to their electorate of Ministers.

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Well I know you’re a big fan of the constituency question time, Peter, and I am too, I am too, but I am looking forward to it being started today. Obviously for years and years and years since I was here for 22 years the question time questions from the government are about showcasing our decisions and our policies. What we’re trying to do is make them more specific to particular constituencies so that people in those constituencies can have questions asked by their local member about issues that are important to them. I think that is an important change and makes sit more relevant for the backbenchers in particular in their constituencies and I’m looking forward to it being - becoming a feature of question time and I hope the Labor party will adopt the same practise and give their backbenchers the chance to ask specific questions about the matters in the constituencies.

PETER VAN ONSELEN: Well I wanted to ask you about that and I want to ask you about that now. Is it the government’s view that if the Labor Party don’t take this, that they are somehow, their individuals Members are not showing enough faith or interest in local backyard politics? That’s all a bit of gamesmanship surely.

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: No I’ve always been a believer, I game a speech about this some years ago, about trying to reform question time and make it more interesting, more spontaneous and more relevant to people, and the Government is leading the way with a new innovative idea around constituency questions. If Labor backbenchers want to continue to be handed questions by Bill Shorten’s office and be asked to read them out which have no bearing on their constituency, well that’s a choice that they make. I’m sure after a while the backbenchers in the Labor Party will start asking ‘how come the government has this freedom, that they’re not allowed to enjoy?’

PETER VAN ONSELEN: What’s your response to the suggestion that the Labor Party might go after the government in relation to the trade union royal commission now that there seem to be some preliminary findings, at least, of no criminal wrongdoing by the Opposition Leader.

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Well, the trade union royal commission is about a lot more than just Bill Shorten. I know that he might have a narcissistic personality but the trade union royal commission is not all about Bill Shorten, it’s about the bad practices that have been occurring in the unions, particularly, for example, the ones that have been uncovered around the CFMEU and the MUA and the AWU. Those findings by Dyson Heydon, the Royal Commissioner, that evidence that’s been deduced there will be very important in reforming the trade unions and making them relevant to their members and restoring faith in the trade union. So just because Bill Shorten has had a positive finding and I’m glad that he has, from his perspective, and from everyone’s perspective we want all trade union leaders to be fine upstanding individuals, doesn’t mean that the trade union royal commission is not doing really, really important work, and has already lead to actions being taken by crown prosecutors in particular jurisdictions to try to clean up the trade union movement. And it’s a good reason for the Labor party to support the Registered Organisation Commission Bill and bringing back the Australian Building and Construction Commission.

PETER VAN ONSELEN:You just described the finding in relation to Bill Shorten, or the preliminary findings in relation to bill shorten as positive, do you really mean that though? I mean, Judith Sloane has said in the Australian that cleared doesn’t not meant that actions were ethically right. What’s the government’s view on the difference between something being legal versus illegal versus being ethical or unethical?

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Well look, I’m not going to get into that debate at this stage. I need to examine over time the findings of the Royal Commission. I think there’ll be a report, a final report, being handed down in the months ahead. I think we’ll see a great deal more about all these matters being put forward at that time. Bill Shorten had a positive finding on Friday by the trade union royal commission and I am pleased for him because, as I have said, we want honest union leaders, not dishonest ones.

PETER VAN ONSELEN: And, just an historical question if I can. The Prime Minister, Malcom Turnbull, will be launching Paul Kelly and Troy Bramston’s book on the dismissal, with a whole series of new findings in it. Now, they interview Malcom Turnbull in the course of writing that book so we can garner a little bit from what he said with them in that interview with what he might have to say in his speech. It sounds like, despite being a liberal Prime Minister, Mr Pyne, Malcolm Turnbull tends to think that what the Liberal party under Malcolm Fraser did was wrong during the 1975 process – what’s your view?

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: I think the actions taken by the Opposition in 1974/75 were the correct actions to protect the county from a very, very bad government. And I think the Governor General acted correctly in his dismissing the Whitlam Government. And just because many decades have passed since that time, doesn’t change my view about that and I don’t think we should look back with rose tinted glasses. It’s a matter of historical record, of course, that the Constitution was changed after that, and of course no opposition, Liberal or Labor, has tried to block supply ever since that period of time and that is a matter for the politicians of the day. But, in terms of the constitutions actions taken by Sir John Kerr I believe they were the right actions and he acted entirely within the constitution and the law.

PETER VAN ONSELEN: See, I agree with you Christopher Pyne but maybe we need to sit down together and take Malcolm Turnbull through our view of history versus his but we’ll find out on Wednesday I suppose when he launches the book.

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Well, I think Malcom might be being verballed by a couple of people. When he actually gives his speech we’ll worry about it then, but I’m very confident that Malcolm would agree with most people that Sir John Kerr acted within the powers that he had at the time.

PETER VAN ONSELEN: I don’t doubt that, I don’t doubt that, alright Christopher Pyne we do appreciate your time on the programs as always – we’ll talk to you next sitting week in a fortnight from now, thank you.

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Pleasure, thank you