5AA with Leon Byner

TRANSCRIPT Interview on 5AA – Leon Byner Date: 3 February 2014 Time: 11.06am SUBJECT: Independent Public Schools LEON BYNER: Hey, thanks for joining us. Now, we talk a lot about education on this programme, as you know. But the latest story is that MPs have been invited to be ambassadors for school independence. Independence from what? Let's talk to the Federal Education Minister, Chris Pyne. Chris, good to talk to you. CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Good morning, Leon. LEON BYNER: So what's the answer to that, independence from what? CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Well, independence from excessive red tape bureaucracy and big brother looking over the shoulder of principals and leadership groups and parents in schools, that's where we're heading. In Western Australia, Queensland, Victoria, they have high levels of autonomy because they trust principals and their leadership teams to make decisions. That's not the case everywhere in Australia and we have an initiative that we've announced today, $70 million to have 1500 public schools as independent public schools over the next four years. LEON BYNER: How will you go about doing this, I mean, what sort of things are you gonna do? I mean, are you saying, okay guys, if you're in the list of schools for which we're gonna fund, you will make more decisions locally, which will include what? CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Well, we expect that our money will be used in concert with the States and Territories to probably change the skills set of some of the principals and leadership teams and ready some of the school communities for taking on more decision making and more independence. So our $70 million will not be funnelled to schools that accept being independent public schools, but I'll work with the States and Territories to make the schools ready to be independent public schools. It's not something that you can just do overnight, you have to obviously go through a process of assessment and a process of training so that those schools are a success, which is what we've discovered in Western Australia. The only State that has not agreed to this initiative is South Australia, unfortunately. LEON BYNER: So we’ll be getting no funding, then, for this? CHRISTOPHER PYNE: That's right, we're – there's $5.7 million sitting on the table for South Australia if they... LEON BYNER: So, who's rejected it? CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Jennifer Rankine and the State Labor Government. LEON BYNER: And did she tell you why? CHRISTOPHER PYNE: She says that there's no evidence that independent public schools have improved the outcomes for students. But, look, that just isn't true, and I've sent her a list of references where she can reference the international and all the domestic research that shows that the more autonomous a school, the better the outcomes for students. And, Leon, our only concern should be putting students first, our only concerns should be about the outcome of students. It shouldn't be some ideological, old-fashioned hangover from the seventies... LEON BYNER: Is this really a disguised attack on the Australian Education Union? CHRISTOPHER PYNE: No, not at all. LEON BYNER: It's not? CHRISTOPHER PYNE: What we want to do is, we want parents and principals making more decisions in their schools that improve the outcomes for students, and all the international and domestic evidence indicates that's what happens. LEON BYNER: Okay, give me – okay, let's pick a random South Australian public school that, if Minister Rankine had agreed, you would go in there and you'd fund. So you say that you would up-skill the principal to give them better tools, if you like, to do the job that now they do, which is more – and as much as business development manager than a manager of educators. But apart from that, what are some of the things that the school would do which would better the lot of students? CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Good question. Well, what we've... LEON BYNER: I think people need to hear this. CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Yes. What we see in Western Australia is that principals and their leadership teams are able to choose the staff, the teachers for their school, that they believe that they need and that they'll be the best teachers from the pool available. So what happens now is that a teacher is sent into a school, a position is asked for by a principal and the Department of Education decides who will fill it. In Western Australia, the public school teachers can apply for positions from that pool, which in some cases anything up to 200 applications. A principal and their leadership team can choose the teacher they think is best for their school. This means that the best teachers, the ones that are really hungry for the jobs, are going into independent public schools and this will – this is infecting the entire Western Australian education system to be striving for excellence in teacher quality, not for whatever the Department decides is good. In Western Australia, independent public schools are a one-line budget item in the Western Australian Budget. The principal and their leadership team and the board of the school gets to make decisions about curriculum priorities, languages, science, sport, et cetera, both curriculum and extra-curricular activities, and they engage their local communities. And the Western Australian outcome has been, to quote the study that they did recently, that the Melbourne University did for the Western Australians, they said that – to quote, overall the story of the implementation of independent public schools is a positive one. The initiative has considerably enhanced the functioning of schools, created the opportunity to access more benefits and it will lead to the increased outcomes for the whole school community. That's what we need in South Australia. LEON BYNER: Okay. In your view as Education Minister, what are the five key principles of quality educational leadership? CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Teacher quality... LEON BYNER: Yeah. CHRISTOPHER PYNE: ...a robust curriculum, an engaged parent community, and more autonomy in schools are the four most important things that any government can do to bring about better outcomes for students. LEON BYNER: Chris Pyne, thank you. That's the Federal Education Minister explaining what's happening with school independence, but he's saying that Jennifer Rankine says there's no evidence that that's going to do anything, so there's a few million bucks sitting on the table that isn't going to be spent on it because it's not necessary. 8223 0000 at 1395, Adelaide’s FIVEaa. Ends