2GB - Ben Fordham

[haiku url="https://dl.dropbox.com/s/94fgfmi9tutvag0/2gb18072012.mp3" title="2GB Ben Fordham"]

SUBJECTS: Foreign policy; Parliamentary tactics; Education policy

E&OE…………

Ben Fordham: Nice to see you in the flesh. What are you doing in town?

Christopher Pyne: Well, I’m spending quite a bit of the week here actually doing education forums and various meetings and a bit of media like this. I did Showdown last night and another programme and just basically getting out and about because Tony Abbott is overseas for 10 days and a lot of the leadership group appear to be overseas as well. I’m basically it at the moment.

Fordham: What is Mr Abbott doing overseas? Just refresh my memory.

Pyne: He’s in Washington at the moment. He’s just given and excellent speech to the Heritage Foundation about China and the United States and then he’s going to China and then heading back. He’s obviously working on his foreign policy understanding well before the election is due and then later on this year he’s going to Indonesia.

Fordham: When you say he’s working on his foreign policy understanding, does that mean he doesn’t currently understand foreign policy?

Pyne: No, but I think there’s nothing like being in the venues themselves and meeting with the figures in China or the United States, Indonesia etc in order to get the best possible understanding of foreign affairs.

Fordham: Julia Gillard seems to have a pretty good relationship with Barack Obama, the US President.

Pyne: Well, Julia Gillard said she thought foreign policy was boring. In fact she said she’d rather be talking to school kids in a classroom, which I didn’t think was very Prime Ministerial, but she realised that was a clanger and now she’s pretending she’s interested in foreign policy. Tony Abbott of course if he’s to be the Prime Minister, foreign policy is very important and China, the United States and Indonesia feature pretty highly in those relationships, as does Japan. I think it’s excellent that he’s overseas for a while. It gives me the opportunity to come on your programme.

Fordham: When you size up the Prime Minister in Question Time, give us an idea of what goes into your preparation for something like that because Julia Gillard was historically known as a terrific performer in our parliament. She seems to have lost her mojo. Some say she’s got it back in the last couple of months or so. How do you plan your attack – you’re rolling your eyes when I said she’s got her mojo back. I’ll put that on the record. How do you rate her as a PM? How do you rate her as parliamentary foe?

Pyne: I think it’s very bad that she runs out of the Chamber for all the debates on suspensions of standing orders. It was a big mistake when she started doing that. I think she thought at the time it would kind of take the heat out of the debate, but I think what it’s done is proven she’s just not really up to the job of defending the Government. John Howard when he was the Prime Minister; he always used to take those motions and he would use them as an opportunity to throw back in the faces of the Opposition the Government’s position.

Fordham: You do move those motions against Julia Gillard and the Government as often as you have a glass of water though don’t you?

Pyne: Well, they’re very effective and the fact that the Government complains about it so much only encourages me to do it more often.

Fordham: I’ve got Mike who’s called into speak to Christopher Pyne, the Manager of Opposition Business in the House of Representatives. He is here from Adelaide spending a bit of time in Sydney. Mike, you’ve got a question or a comment?

Caller 1: Ah, yes guys. G’day Chris. Two questions. Why does Madam Deputy Speaker suspend you so often and secondly regarding the suspension of standing orders why don’t you do it more often and why don’t you do it at quarter to three so that ABC telecast it?

Fordham: In terms of timing of those things, because it often happens after it’s gone off the public broadcast, is that right?

Pyne: Well we have suspension and standing orders when we think it’s appropriate. So sometimes it happens at quarter to three, sometimes we have done it at ten past two, sometimes we do it at ten past three, it just depends.

Fordham: Onto Mikes other question, why are you such a naughty boy?

Pyne: Well being the Manager of Opposition Business in the House, it comes with the territory and that you’re going to end up being suspended more than anybody else because you are at the spear tip of the Oppositions attack. I think Anthony Albanese and I hold the record for being suspended more than anybody else in the last few years because he was manager of Opposition Business before me.

Fordham: Are you happy to be known as the Coalitions attack dog?

Pyne: I don’t think I am known that way. I hope I’m known as an effective parliamentary performer.

Fordham: I mean I’m trying to think back, there was a time when Tony Abbott was regarded as the Coalition’s attack dog, and I’m just thinking within Coalition ranks, I mean you are the block that tends to go hardest and loudest. I can’t think of anyone else who would wear that tag more appropriately than you.

Pyne: Well Tony was the Leader of the House, in which case he was at the spear tip of the government’s defence and also their attack on the opposition, before that it was Peter Reith. Most of this Labor Government it has been me and it just comes with the territory. Somebody is going to have to take the fight up to Anthony Albanese or Julia Gillard and that usually tends to be the Manager of Opposition Business.

Fordham: Ok, just a little bit of news off the wire which I’ll ask you about. Five members of the Indonesian Military have just been arrested for alleged involvement in a people smuggling operation. The five soldiers were arrested this morning in the company of 41 asylum seekers believed to be from Iran and Syria. That’s interesting that members of Indonesian Military, that the Indonesian Military have managed to catch some people smugglers or asylum seekers became most of them tend to leave without too much fanfare. Also, the added component that there are 5 members of the Indonesian Military arrested alleged as people smugglers

Pyne: That’s obviously a very serious issue, a very serious matter.

Fordham: Are we seeing more cooperation in the region? We’ve seen Sri Lanka stopping boats from leaving; we now have a crackdown in Indonesia. Is Julia Gillard getting that regional framework that she’s been talking about?

Pyne: No quite the opposite in fact. In the Howard Government the relationship with Indonesia was one of the preeminent reasons why the boats stopped coming. We put a lot of effort into that relationship; we put a lot of effort on the ground into the relationship with boats, with people with AFP Officers and support for Indonesia. That’s was one of the primary reasons we had such success with our border protection policies. This story is as it says a very serious matter which obviously the Indonesians will be taking very seriously, as will we.

Fordham: Let’s take a call from Scott, who has called in on 131873 my guest in the studio Christopher Pyne. Gday Scott.

Caller 2: Gday, thank you for the opportunity. Christopher, I’d just like to say that I take my hat off to you. You are an outstanding politician, you are very articulate, you get to the issues in a manner which no other politician does, and you explain it well. I have to say you are the best politician in Parliament at this point in time.

Fordham: Fair rap. Thank you for the call Scott.

Fordham: Thank you for the call Scott

Pyne: You can pick up your free album after the show Scott. So, well hang on they don’t have albums anymore – what am I saying?

Fordham: If Scott says you are the best politician – why are you not the leader or the deputy leader?

Pyne: Well because we have an excellent leader and deputy leader in Tony Abbott and Julie Bishop, and they will be the Prime Minister and deputy leader, hopefully after the next election if we are fortunate enough to win. I very much enjoy being the manager opposition of business and if Tony Abbott is good to me after the election and we’ve won, I hope to be leader of the house and a cabinet minister, and I would be very happy with that.

Fordham: Would you like the lead one day, or would you like to be deputy leader one day?

Pyne: You know what Ben? I’ve been so close to leaders and deputy leaders now for 19 years that I just don’t think it’s a job that I would want, or seek. I just seek to be a cabinet minister in a government.

Fordham: You sound like Kevin Rudd

Pyne: Oh please, no, please no

Fordham: I’m just happy doing what I’m doing

Pyne: I’m very happy doing what I’m doing

Fordham: Let me go to Rod, who wants to say hello to Christopher Pyne, g’day Rod.

Caller 3: Hello Ben how are you?

Fordham: I’m well.

Caller 3: Chris, I wouldn’t say you were the best politician in parliament at present moment, but I can tell you what, you are damn good mate. And all I can say is this Gillard Government has fallen on its sword by the lady telling untruths to us, mate don’t ever let the Liberal Party tell us untruths because I tell you what – you will go the same way as they have.

Fordham: Thank you for the call Rod. I mean he picks up on something which is the biggest thing with the carbon tax of the lot. I mean people have got concerns about money, cost of living, all those things but the thing that annoys them the most was the lie.

Pyne: There’s no doubt about it and look, it’s the hurdle that the Prime Minister just can’t get over, in spite of the fact they have done everything they can to try and sell this terrible tax, the public as you say are very focused on the cost of living, they are very concerned about electricity prices, but even if they believe every aspect of what the Government says, even if they believe it, they still can’t get past the fact the Prime Minister said there will be no carbon tax under a government I lead six days before the election, and then broke her promise to do a deal with the greens in order to stay in Government.

Fordham: You have been speaking a lot about class sizes and also about weeding out the average teachers, how do you think teachers are responding to hearing about your plan to weed out the ones who are not up to scratch?

Pyne: I think they will respond very positively. The survey of teachers themselves that I talked about on Monday night at the Sydney Institute showed that 9 out of 10 teachers said that it didn’t matter how hard they worked, the didn’t think they got any acknowledgment in their school and 7 out of 10 said it didn’t matter how poor their colleagues were – they knew nothing would happen to them – there would be no penalty. Now that is soul destroying for the teaching profession. That is one of the reasons why so many people do not want to go into teaching, because they look at it and think that is not a profession the way I want it to choose a profession in the future if you get no better reward, it doesn’t matter how hard you work. You get to work early, you leave work late, you take the debating team or the rugby team and yet you get paid less or the same as the person who does absolutely nothing, other than turn up to their classrooms.

Fordham: You also say smaller class sizes don’t make a bigger difference than a lot of people make out?

Pyne: it has been an obsession in the last ten years in Australia and the jury is in on smaller class sizes. The OECD report of 2009 shows that in spite of smaller class sizes student outcomes have gone backwards and in spite of spending 44 per cent more on education our outcomes have gone backwards, so it’s not money and it’s not class sizes.

Fordham: My guest is Christopher Pyne in the Sydney live studio, Henry is on the line, hello Henry.

Caller 4: Just in relation to the suspension of standing orders, I do watch question time every time it’s on and 99 per cent of them are before 3 o’clock to the opposition can get their ten second grab on the news and it’s no wonder the government walks out when they start them because a they’re a stunt; and b they do them every single time during question time; and c it’s just an opportunity for the likes of Christopher and the rest of them to harangue and harass the Prime Minister, so it’s not a debating tactic it’s just a stunt for the media, let’s be honest.

Fordham: Did you want to respond to that?

Pyne: Well Henry we don’t do it every day, we don’t do most of them before 3 o’clock...

Fordham: Every second day?

Pyne: No, not every second day, the point is that the government doesn’t answer any of our questions, anyone watching question time...

Fordham: That’s because question time is a complete joke, and it always has been, you don’t have to answer the questions.

Pyne: Under this government, Julia Gillard never makes any attempt at all to answer our questions, so for an Opposition we have very few tools at our disposal.

Fordham: What about getting rid of Dorothy Dixers, so Dorothy Dixers are questions asked by your own side, we hear them every day – Prime Minister would you please outline...

Pyne: ...how marvellous you are...

Fordham: ...the benefits of the family payments as a result of the carbon tax and then it goes into a three minute recorded dialogue of Julia Gillard giving Julia Gillard. That is a waste of time, why do we have to sit through that?

Pyne: There are a lot of things we could do to improve question time. We’ve made some improvements in this Parliament. One of the good things about this Parliament is that we had the agreement for a better Parliament earlier this term so we managed to get time limits on the answers to questions so Ministers simply couldn’t keep talking as Kevin Rudd did once famously for 11 minutes and 50 seconds.

Fordham: Do you think he will be back?

Pyne: I think he’s coming back, sure, and so does his brother Greg, there will be Rudds everywhere. Rudds in all directions. Julia Gillard must be looking forward to that.

Fordham: Look one of our favourite listeners has called in, let’s take Sean and then we’ll have to say goodbye to Christopher Pyne. Hello Sean?

Caller 5: Hello Ben, I just want to say that Christopher Pyne is the best politician and you get in the zone and I watched you on television and you said Julia Gillard is as popular as anthrax and I thought what a hell of a line... you keep going because you’re doing a brilliant job and you will be in Government.

Fordham: This is the Christopher Pyne fan club, Sean thanks for that.

Pyne: This has gone much better than I expected.

Fordham: Maybe Mr Abbott should stay overseas?

Pyne: No, Mr Abbott is marvellous; I can’t wait for him to come back.

Fordham: Christopher Pyne, thank you.

ENDS